My Stand-In (2024)

Incomparável!! Um trabalho absurdamente bem feito.

Sinceramente, gente, essa série é uma das melhores da Tailândia. Se não for a melhor. Só poderei dizer, de fato, se é, ou não, quando assistir o final. Sim, o relacionamento deles é tóxico, mas não é tóxico como em TharnType ou KinnPorsche. A série deixa bem claro que o Ming é um lixo e que o Joe não tem amor próprio. É romântico, mas não é romantizado. Tá tudo bem claro ali. Além de roteiro, diálogos, fotografia e trilha sonora absolutamente maravilhosos. Não tem aqueles clichês horrorosos, que tem em todas da GMM. Os protagonistas atuam super bem. O elenco todo é muito bom!

Quem deixou de assistir porque tem drama ou sofrimento demais, está perdendo uma história maravilhosa, muito bem contada, cheia de altos e baixos, que te prende. Vai ser um marco na produção de BLs na Tailândia. Elevou DEMAIS o nível. E que cada vez venham mais BL's como tão bons, ou melhores, do que este

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Uma Boa Série Com Falhas de Roteiro

My Stand-In teve uma história bem legal. Atores consagrados na indústria Boys Love, com uma ressalva para dois atores coadjuvantes, Billy Possathorn (fez o papel do secretário Jim) e para o ator Tanathorn Charoenratanaporn (fez o papel de Sol), sem falar em tantos outros que foram igualmente bons.

Qual a falha? Acredito que fazer um BL que vai passar por essa fase de encarnação não muito fácil, isso porque muitas vezes, como foi o caso aqui, o roteirista acaba por deixando as transições entre cenas confusas. Ao observarmos os momentos em que o Joe no corpo do novo personagem, interpretado por Winner Tanatat, ele só aparece quando o próprio Joe se olha no espelho, para os demais que ali estão, mesmo quando chamam o Joe para conversar o corpo que sempre aprece é do Joe que “morreu”. Tanto do ponto de vista religioso quanto para a produção isso gera uma certa confusão. Do ponto de vista religioso, o corpo não existe mais, na produção, é preciso inserir o público no conteúdo e estas transições de cenas servem justamente para isso.

O sofrimento do Joe também foi muito tenso durante o BL, pensei até que iria estender para uns 14 episódios. Contudo, gostei do BL, foi muito bom! Apenas a ressalva mesmo quanto as transições das cenas.

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Why can't people seem to appreciate flawed characters?

This review won't be a review per say but moreso another perspective of the show when compared to the majority of the negative reviews on this site. I feel the need to do this especially because a handful of these reviews almost made me decide not to watch this show. I won't go into a lot of details regarding the storyline since so many reviews have already done so. However, I'd like to leave my two cents here because most of the reviews shown here are negative and most of them are based on two things - Joe's naivety and Ming's toxicity.

One thing about this series is that it depcts toxic relationships with very flawed characters. It's been advertised since the beginning, it's based in an infamously toxic chinese novel (by an author who's well known for her toxic main leads), there's sinopsis, tags, trailer, etc. And yet people still seem to be hiper fixated in complaining about it, as if it hasn't been advertised at all.

Don't like these themes? Don't watch.

This is the same issue with Kinnporsche (which has two directors in common). So many people review bombing with negative ratings regarding the toxic storyline. There was even a review that complained so much and at the end considered this one of the best series of this year - giving this a 6. At least be coherent with your words and your scoring.

I understand the issue people have with Ming, he's an obvious red flag who is toxic from the beginning, a very flawed character who is depicted since the beginning as such. Flawed characters have existed in stories, series and movies for a long time and oftentimes they give way to intrigue storylines and help capture the viewers attention to try to understand how this person behaves the way they do. Flawed characters are real and human and I don't understand how so many people fail to appreciate that this type of representation is needed in art too. Yes, Ming is a huge asshole and a toxic narcissist. That makes him an even more compelling main character.

As for Joe, he's an absolute cinammon roll. He's someone who falls in love with someone he shouldn't. I see so many people stating how he's naive for liking Ming and that it's not realistic. Excuse me? How many people end up in toxic relationships despite the clear signs? How many people fail to see the red flags because of the rose-colored glasses? It's as realistic as it can get. Fortunately, My Stand-in still manages not to be as toxic as some relationships in real life get - and not as toxic as the original novel, thankfully. I feel like this show actually managed to tell the story really well, they allowed for Ming's character to grow and for Joe to realize that no matter how much he tried, he couldn't escape his feelings for Ming.

Sure, y'all can say Joe's dumb - he is. But it feels weird to reduce his feelings and struggles to just that - naivety and stupidity. Joe and Ming are such complex characters and to reduce this complexity to just being dumb or toxic is like missing the whole point of the show. The story isn't told just by dialogue or just by nc scenes. There's so many small details the directors focused on to conect the storyline. The actors were amazing too, the change in Up's eyes depending on Ming's emotional stability in different parts of the show was mesmerizing to watch - he's such a great actor. Poom was also absolutely amazing as Joe, reflecting his emotional maturity before and after his death.

Flawed and difficult characters are extremely complex. They're harder to understand, harder to act and harder to love. It's a challenge for the actors involved in these storylines and it's a challenge for the whole team. Yet, they're the most intriguing, the ones that make our brains work to understand, to fill in the blanks. There's a reason why we love villains. It's the same train of thought. Flawed characters are relatable, even if only a tiny little bit. Sure, in Ming's case, I really hope he's not as relatable to everyone out there, but there's realism to his character, like it or not.

This is why I don't understand the hate. I understand the constructive criticism and I have my own too, but to review bomb a show like this based on something it has advertised since the beginning? I don't get it.

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If you give it a chance it might surprise you

Well, that was quite a get-on-nerves show, but still interesting to watch. I've checked most of the reviews and I'm quite surprised they are so negative.

STORY
It could be written better.. I didn't have a chance to read the novel that series is based on, but I'm sure that even that half of angst wasn't portrayed in this show. So it might be for the best.. who knows what kind of cringe we would see.. So it's good as it is.
Dark romance? I don't see it clearly. It's too corny to be considered as dark.

(English is not my first language, so, please, bare with me 😢)

let's talk about characters

MING

Yes , he is definitely NOT SAINT, but also he CAN'T be defined as a total red flag. In comparison to Day from "Love syndrome" or Vegas "KP" Ming is just a naughty kid who begs for attention and yet might be possessive and arrogant from time to time. I really love Up's acting skills. It's incredible seeing his versatility (compared to a lovely writer). Also, I loved the character development. We were able to see what the loss of someone important in your life can do to you. Maybe it would be much better if there was another special episode about Ming's life after Joe's disappearance. Since a lot of people found concerning the swift change in Ming's personality.
The only thing that I can blame on him is that he couldn't talk about his feelings properly instead he was trying to manipulate Joe in order to get what he wanted.
Well, I can't see him as the most toxic red flag. HE IS JUST A MANIPULATIVE RICH KID WHO DESPERATELY WANTED TO BE LOVED.

***
I want to complain about the dressing style that they came up with for Ming.. like they are trying to portray him as a powerful and manipulative top, but dressing him like a BABY GIRL with rosey cheeks..

JOE

This is my first time seeing Poom in acting. He's incredibly good (sometimes he reminds me of Jeff Satur). He's eyes like a mirror that depicts true emotions.

Well, poor Joe. He literally has been through hell.. He was so naive to let everyone manipulate him, especially Ming. It was clear that he had affection towards Ming, but still self-respect must be in priority. It's understandable, he fell in love and was blinded by it.

Everybody's blaming him for how he could get money on these conditions..Just imagine.. you're in a strangers body but in the same surroundings, have no money, no career, acquired a new mother with poor health and lots of debt .You need to scratch from the top but you have no time. What would you do to survive?

It was so frustrating to see him living in a shadow of other people even in his past self's. As he made a choice to live his life like this he has to cope with it.

TONG

Still mad about him getting a happy ending after all of the awful things he has done. Unpleasant character. Definitely deserves a good punch. He's one of those people who are trying to look better by taking credits for someone else's achievements.

But at least he showed that he will take responsibility for his child.

P'Wut

His acting sometimes made me feel uncomfortable. They were trying to create a father figure for Joe, but failed. He only kept saying that he's gonna help him, but in the end of it all Joe had to deal with everything by himself. Unreliable.

I still have a lot of questions about the story but I can't remember even a half of it..

1. What happened to the soul of Joe2?
2. Wasn't it strange for Joe's mother to see that her son's completely changed?
3. Who was that mysterious master and why does everybody believe him?
4. How did Ming's parents forgive Tong that easily..?


I really love the color correction and camera work. The shots were amazing. But the musical accompaniment.. 3 damn songs repeating again and again ..

Overall, I can understand what this show was trying to tell us. "Love wins all no matter what" and " family bound is one of the strongest".

I don't think that I'm gonna rewatch it someday.
Soild 8.

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A masterpiece, not just among BL dramas."

I don't watch many BL dramas and have little experience with them, so I compare this one with other favorite Asian dramas : it's an excellent show and shouldn't be confined to the BL category. The acting is top, especially from the actor Up, who, for me, is a revelation in Asian cinema. The plot is also not overused—where else have you seen a main character, a Top one, who is in love with another for half the series (even in hetero dramas, the male lead rarely loves someone else)? There were some plot holes, and the acting of support characters was so-so, but the main couple and the love line between them is incredible, awesome and very captivating. The intimate scenes were top. Before this, I had watched more modest dramas, but I really liked everything here.
As for the plot: Ming is an abuser and far from a positive character, but I was rooting for him from start to finish. The actor outperformed his partner, or perhaps Poom's character was just more modest and had a less complex role.
Thank you production for this great and incredible show.

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Almost perfect!!

Pros:
* Up
* Up is so fine
* Up is a great actor
* Poom is also a great actor
* Poom is also fine
* The plot was plotting
* The drama was dramaing
* I cried
* I was sat EVERY week

Cons:
* NC scene looked like a blanket monster
* No justice was served to anyone
* Tong got away with everything!!!
* Tong again
* I wanted a different ending
* The sneezing was dumb
* The whole back plot was also dumb
* There was no purpose to the psychic guy
* Things got confusing and didn't really add up in areas they wanted there to be suspense and fan theories were more interesting and made more sense in these instances

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Very toxic but really cute

I have to admit. This is one of my first Thai BL dramas so I'm new to the concept but I really loved this drama.

It was recommended to me by a friend and when she sat me down to start this series, I was a little skeptical due to the high rate of toxicity that was supposed to be in this one. Tropes like that usually throw me off UNLESS there's a healthy slide of redemption that comes with it. And boy does this drama serve that redemption HOT.

The drama works with a time travel element that's been done quite well. It starts off with Joe, one of the mains, working at a filmset where he comes to his demise. He then wakes up in a different body with the same name and meets all the people he used to know before including Ming his ex boyfriend. The series then takes us back to a time before the accident (2-3 years) where Joe and Ming meet. Joe works as a stuntman/stand-in for a well known actor named Tong. He meets Ming at a filming location where Ming accidentily hugs him, thinking he's Tong. Ming is secretly in love with Tong and wants to be with him, but Tong is in a relationship with Ming's sister. And thus.. since Joe and Tong are so similar (especially their backside) Ming starts something with Joe so he can have some kind of kinship with Tong. And that's messed up. Joe, who is completely unaware of Ming's intentions, falls in love with Ming and wants to take things as far as living and sharing everything together.

At that point I didn't think there was every going to be a redemption for Ming. He manipulated everything and everyone to make it go his way not ever considering what it might do to Joe if things ever came to light but the worst had yet to come. Ming was about the worst character I had ever come across in dramaland in levels of toxicity (eventhough it's one of my first BL series) and I seriously considered dropping the drama if this continued.

But things got better and they were done really well. I absolutely love that the drama doesn't excuse the toxic behaviour but actually takes the time for its characters to learn from it and grow. At the end of it I came to really love Ming and root for him.

Likes:
- The acting was amazing! Especially the main leads! Up made me hate Ming through and through but also made me love him to death. Poom's portrayal of Joe was incredible!
- How they worked with the fact that Joe was in a new body. They reminded the audience of it a couple of times by having the new Joe appear in mirrors and some scenes every now and then. I was shook everytime it happened because it was a reminder of something the old Joe had lost but also gained.
- Ming's redemption arc. They could not have done it better. It really showed how much Ming was willing to change for the better and how much he was willing to put in for Joe. He learned from his mistakes and became a better person. I loved that.

Dislikes:
- Sol. I didn't really feel anything for his character. The actor was a bit motionless. He was supposed to be a K-pop star but the whole thing just felt a little off.
- The redemption for Ming's father and Tong. The series trying to put some good light on these two made me angry. The reasoning behind the dad's behaviour was truly insane and Tong, in my opinion, didn't deserve any forgiveness. He'd done too much evil at that point to be so easily forgiven by everyone.
- The series could have been a couple of episodes longer. They introduced another couple to the audience in episode 11 which threw me off a little. Also, I would have like to have a little more background about the Joe who's body was taken by our main lead Joe. Too bad they didn't really touch up on that side of the story.

Overal, I really loved this drama. It's a definite must-watch for everyone who likes BL's (with a little toxicity on the side).

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Joe Needs To Be Slap With A Rubber Chicken

What annoys me the most is that, Ming put Joe through hell, all because he was in love with a guy who acts like he sniffs glue and sells hair nets on e-bay.

That being said. There must have been a 2-for-1 special on stupidity, cuz Joe sure bought a whole lot.

CHARACTERS:
Listen. Joe is a bummer. He makes sadness look pathetic. He’s like that friend who always ruins the mood whenever you ask them how they’re doing:

ME: Oh, hey, friend, how was your day?

Bummer Friend: Nothing much. My cat is in therapy. I wanna get a perm, but I don’t think I have the face for it. My parents threw me out so I’m living under a bridge now, and I got hit by a bus last week and died. 😑

Sure, sure, we can argue that Joe is pathetic because he couldn’t catch a break, and every time he did, it was at the expense of his self-respect, but damn… the dude just bummed me out. So much that when he died the second time, I was chewing on my popcorn like:

ME: Oh, noo, dude…you like, got shot and stuff…you rolling down the stairs dude…is you dead again?... (Side note: Did they really have to make him roll down the stairs like that? It was just sad.)

And yes, we all love/hate a no-self respecting, pathetic love-sick fool character. The only reason I watched ‘Theory Of Love’ was that bathroom scene where Gun's character got his heartbroken, and he was crying under the shower, but the water stopped, so he had to use bottled water. I laughed like there was no tomorrow, then went and made popcorn so I could binge-watch the rest of the series, and judge him through the screen.

So yeah, throughout the series whenever Joe did anything dumb, which was every time he opened his mouth. I went:

ME: Yayy, go on honey, be a dumb-ass, stay with that dude who took your virginity and can’t even remember it, and refers to you as a ‘stand in’, because he’s in love with a guy built like a Minecraft table.

Some of the things Joe did, and allowed Ming to do to him, busted my mind. And what do you mean he DIED again because of TONG! TONG!!!  I understand if it was like for a person person, but Tong? Come on son! Do-gooders should come with a ‘self-sacrificing idiot’ forehead tag or something, cuz... Bishes be crazy!

And sure, Joe was a tortured, handsome fella who needed love, But, Joe, Joe, oh Joey, Jojo, Jeremiah, Josephina. To quote Earth from Moonlight Chicken: ‘How you gonna be poor, gay and dumb at the same time, child?.’ He suffered so much because… *check notes*

1. He had no family. (His dream was for someone to turn on the lights in his house.)
2. He had (1) friend. (And that friend wanted to get into his pants, but yaay friendship, right?)
3. He was a ‘stand-in’ boyfriend(eff buddy?). (Sure Ming hit him in the head with a baseball bat, kidnapped him, chained him up, caused him to fall off a cliff and die, but hey, at least they had his-and-his mugs. So, awwww love.)

I don’t even know what to say about Joe. Do I dislike the character, I guess not, because he’s too sad to even dislike. I just couldn’t get over all the dumb decision he made… **check notes** again:

1. Gave his virginity to Ming who was drunk off his arse
2. Asked Ming to move in with him so he could turn on his lights for him.
3. Died, came back, and went straight to Ming to be his stand-in ho. He wasn't even the main ho at that point, he was like a stand-in ho, for a stand-in ho.
4. Accepted Ming’s broke arse! (Dude, you are poor, how you gonna take care of him and your sick fake mom?)
5. Got kidnapped (again) and beaten for TONG. TONG!!
6. Died again so he can protect Ming. (You know, the guy who treated him like used slippers.)

I kept screaming, ‘No, girl, no, no!’ every time he made another dumb decision. Homeboy gets a second chance, complete with a whole new face and everything. And I thought he was gonna move cities, start over, join a local church or something but, the mfer was like:

JOE: Well…the thing is…you know…Ming glued the mugs together, you know the one I broke when he mistook me for his sister’s husband, who he’s in love with? Haha… he has changed… he wears old lady blouses, and wants to keep me as his ho… in exchange for money, so… yeah, *in love noises*

ME: This dumb-ass mother… *throws chair**

For one split second I thought he'd finally learned something, because he was like : "No Ming, this second chance is mine!" (Only to immediately proceed to try and get out of a moving car.) A moving car. Like???? And after all that yelling and 'Ming forget the old Joe, this body doesn't love you', homeboy didn't even make it half way down the traffic light!

And while he was talking about 'If you loved the old Joe why did you make me your paramour.' my arse was rolling my eyes at the screen going 'dude stop using that fancy arse word, use your government name, yous is a ho. A stand-in ho.'

Joe just vexes me! Every time he gives Ming those poppy dog in-love eyes I go.
Child! Child! Stop, Run. You must be a special brand of stupid to die, get a second chance, then go straight to the person who caused your death. JUST, WHY?? ARE YOU OKAY?

At this point, I’m gonna console myself by believing that Joe is color blind, cuz there’s no rational reason as to why he returned to Ming a second time. WHY??? And in the finale he’s talking about 'I forgive you, forgive yourself, I’ll always choose you cuz I don’t know what I’ll live for if not for you?' ‘CHILD! How about your fake mom? huh? How about living a life where you are not afraid your partner will hit you upside the head with a bat??’

You know what, eff Joe! My blood pressure can’t.

But like, Poom is an amazing actor!! Most bl actors looks like they are laughing or sniffing glue whenever they cry, but Poom was different. Even his eyes could act. Beautiful talented man. But Joe though, the bummer can go hug a tree.

Okay, on a side note, are we going to ignore the fact that, that woman’s son died and she didn’t even got to mourn? Sure, Joe is a good son to her and whatnot, but damn, homeboy took over that body with zero guilt.

—
MING. oh, MING.

HAHAHA. Some people talking about, ‘Girl, Ming is such a RED FLAG. AND???!’ HAHAHA. My sister, even if na red sea, I go still take cup drink ‘em!

Cuz we love drama in this house. And Ming, oh Ming, talk about a guy you wanna punch under a mistletoe. My anger when it came to him was unhealthy. Do I wish he go bury himself in a hole at the centre of the sun and die? Sure. Is his toxic arse gonna make me add this drama to one of my favs? HECK YEAH.

Listen. Ming, like an old rag, deserves to be taking out every spring and beaten. This little guy, who acts like the world bothers him (I just remembered Joe let a collage? graduate drive him off a cliff.) mistreated our gentle soul Joe, because he saw someone’s back in a mall one time. I mean, how you gonna fall in love with Tong, your sister’s boyfriend, who looks like a dollar store bubblehead?

Ming was so toxic and for what? TONG? The guy who used his unborn child as a bargain? The guy who on so many occasions broke your heart. TONG!

And after everything Ming did, the writers gave him like two ‘redeemable’ scenes, changed one red traffic light into green, said sorry under some shooting star, made him wear those silly cute aprons, and expected me to forgive him. LMAO I’m not Joe, I’m not gonna come back and let him eff me again. One time is enough!

But they almost got me in the finale though ^^. With all the smiling, crying and shooting stars, and tiny clay pots and aprons… but I stood my ground like. ’No, you will not get me to forgive Ming, not today Satan!’ So yeah, eff the tiny pot , apron, and the shooting stars, I’mma still hold on to my hatred.

Also, how in the hell did Ming manage to stop Joe from opening that afterlife door? Mfer is next level of toxic. He was like: 'Bish, where you think you going, I'm not done with you. If you don't get your arse back in here.' Poor Joe, the devil works hard, but Ming works harder.

UP did so well with this character, because I see UP on my fyp on tiktok and I grin and coo and go, bestest boy. But the moment Ming shows up on screen I wanna throw tiny rocks into his eyes and push him off a small cliff.

TONG
Hmm. Ha. Hmhm. Haha. Hahaha. HAHAKAHBIERJWOJFWNF. AHHHHHHHHHHH. GAWDDD, sure Ming deserves to be poke in the eye with a sharp object, but TONG deserves to be slap repeatedly with a glove, then you know, kicked into that black hole at the centre of the milky way. Eff that dude!

And ,and, after all he did, he got no retribution whatsoever!! I swear, this world is not fair. And the last episode wanted me to feel happy for him, but he’s smiling and I’m rolling my eyes like:, ‘Happiness don’t even look right on him, dude out here looking like the inside of a pencil case. Arrgggg, take a long nap under that pool, please!!’

Somewhere out there in drama world, Tong is happy with his wife and chubby son, and I wish he steps on a lego every time he smiles. And he chokes every time he drinks. XDD

SOL:
Now tell me why every time this dude popped up, I went, ‘My brother, my brother, go sit somewhere, this ain’t about you!’ LMAO. Sure he was an o-kay-ish friend, but he was like a tiny red-flag with a green wrapping, so shifty, looking like that one lizard in ‘SING!’

In the finale when he took his sorry-arse bag and got into the car with the stranger, I was like: ‘Sure, dude, get kidnap and die. See if I care.’ So, yeah, I wish him all the best, I guess.

PLOT
Interesting concept, I am tempted to read the book I heard this was based on. I think the actors did what they were supposed to. I hated and liked them accordingly, so they did their job well.

THINGS THAT DIDN’T MAKE SENSE
- Joe’s fighting skills going away whenever he needed it
- Writers trying to make us forgive Ming
- Joe literally letting himself be kidnap for TONG
- TONG being a popular actor. (Like, did that dude ever shoot enough scenes to make a finish drama?)
- TONG being forgiven!! Seriously??? Nothing?

THINGS THAT MADE SENSE
**Crickets**
Edit: 07/10/24 : I found a scene that made sense. The chicken fight between Sol and Ming. SKSKSKS, it didn't make sense, but it also made sense, and Joe just being the ignored third party made it so fun to watch. Upon rewatching, my ratings have gone up, Joe's eyes deserves a whole star, like they were acting more than the actor himself XD

Anyway, I might write more later on the finale, especially on the family, but for this review I just wanted to vent my frustration with Joe.

All in all, one of the best shows this year, up there with Unknown.

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Great concept!!!

My Stand-In has multiple layers, making it a highly textured and emotionally complex BL series.

The show has a highly refreshing concept, which brings up some interesting questions on the relationship between love and personhood. If the person you loved died and revived as someone else in a different body, how does that alter the nature of the relationship?

The series should be lauded for not shying away from complex, and deeply flawed characters. It explores fairly mature themes, given the show’s sexual relationships and the characters’ manipulative nature. Perhaps it can be criticised for romanticising toxicity, but I don’t think it is any series’ job to be an ad for civics and moral education. Characters like Ming are everywhere in real life.

Ming’s mercurial tendencies and obsessiveness makes him challenging to like and root for as a character. But for Joe, who has been collateral damage from getting caught in the crosshairs of power struggles – he finally gets his turn to understand what it means to have somebody to fight for you.

And it was superbly satisfying to watch.

Full review: https://asianblreviews.wordpress.com/2024/07/20/my-stand-in-2024-bl-review/

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Somehow became my favourite show of the year

I know why people don't love the show, it's a "dark romance" and a lot of the stuff that the ML (Ming) does is pretty beyond the pale. However, I knew that going in so I wasn't really expecting this to be a fun/lighthearted show. Expectations are kind of everything here.

The book is based on a danmei novel, 职业替身 or Professional Body Double by Shui Qian Cheng. If you look at the tags on the NovelUpdates page you'll have a pretty good idea of what you're getting into. https://www.novelupdates.com/series/professional-body-double/ (And the novel is more challenging than the show so be warned).

This isn't usually a genre I go in for, but I have to admit I got completely hooked. The acting is incredibly good, the series is well-produced, the pacing is great, and the chemistry between the two leads is fantastic. While the plot is a little over the top in some ways, it rarely felt cheesy or overdone, and I think the team handled the localization and adaptation incredibly well.

If you don't like heavy angst you will not have a good time here, if you need characters to have extensive redemption arcs, you probably will not have a good time here. However, if you enjoy a heavy amount of drama, suffering, and crying, you're in the right place. There are lighter moments, and a lot of beautiful ones too, it was all worth it to me.

We can have a productive conversation about the types of tropes that are common in BL and romance generally, and the harm that they can cause, however, I think dismissing it out of hand because it has upsetting elements doesn't contribute to that discussion. If you don't like it that's very understandable, it's a lot, but I think it's a show with a lot to offer for those who want to engage with it while understanding what it is.

-- Spoilers Below--
More extensive thoughts:
Yes Ming absolutely sucks, he's possessive, self-centered, and demanding. However, he is also capable of growth and change, he's never going to be perfect (he's always going to be a spoiled richboy), but it's clear that he understands the mistakes he made when he was younger and regrets them deeply. Some people don't think he was redeemed "enough", but the point is that Joe forgives him, and they're letting go of the past and moving forward with the expectation that they can do better this time.

I think people also get really frustrated at Joe's character. He's incredibly selfless and forgiving, he rarely puts himself first, and he doesn't seem to know how to let go of this guy who hurt him so badly. But all of those things are important parts of his character. It's not as if he's some complete doormat, he's able to stand up for himself in most situations where he knows he's been wronged, he gets angry, he pushes back. But at his core he is just a very selfless and kind person, and that doesn't change even in his second life. He also truly, deeply, loves Ming. Maybe he should move on, but at this point he's not going to, he has what he's always wanted, which is for Ming to love him as much as he did, to have someone waiting for him at home.

I thought the characters were all so compelling and interesting, it was so hard to stop watching, or wait for the next episode. I truly fell in love with this series despite everything. It was all about ending the cycles of revenge and hate and despair, growing and becoming better together. I may be reading into it quite a lot, but I'm grateful this show exists <3

I said this elsewhere, but forgiveness is not about "deserving" it, that's not the point. Ming and Joe are choosing to move on, to let go of the past and stop repeating the cycle. Eternal punishment is pointless, and endless hatred and revenge isn't the point of the series.

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A ride or die love story.

Imagine, finding out that the person you are extremely in love with uses you as a substitute of the one he is obsessed with; you die with that grief and reborn and again face the same predicament?

Now imagine, using the person who loves you unconditionally as a substitute of someone you had a crush as a teen only to cause his death and realize the one you really love and had the crush on is actually the one who also loved you; but died because of you and never gonna come back and no matter how much money, influence and power you hold you cannot bring him back so you have to settle with another substitute?

Ming and Joe are both extreme lovers. They are so much in love all the humiliations, betrayal, lies, wait and even death can't tear them apart. Is that we call star crossed lovers?

Ming is a complex character, embodying both shadows and light. He had powers and knew how to wield them. Joe is our golden retriever. Due to his parents' early death and him raising himself has made him more mature and empathetic toward people around him. He was the only one who could tolerate Ming's arrogant personality and childish temperament. Ming used to be so docile with Tong but with Joe he showed his real emotions- happy, flirty, angry, desperate and even abusive.

Joe from the beginning was mesmerized by Ming's beauty and was simping over him, which gave Ming power over Joe. Joe was the sole investor in the relationship. He kept trying and trying. Pursuing and coaxing Ming, but still couldn't shake his heart. If Joe hadn't died would Ming still realize his feelings? If Sol weren't in the picture, would he realize his fear of losing Joe?

Ming took Joe as a substitute. He wanted Joe's full commitment even though he was obsessed over Tong himself. His condescending personality will definitely get on audience's nervers. He acted like he owned Joe, and in front of his willfullness Joe's feeling are not valid.

When Ming went to Joe's condo for the first time, he understood the meaning of home. Their love blossomed in that condo. Ming who could afford any luxurious mansion did not want to let go of that old, small condo where Joe and he had so many memories. This is why, even a proud and arrogant person like him didn't leave the condo despite being repeatedly told to. But I think he was a little confused because it was Joe, not the condo, that was his home.

Ming knew Joe liked him for his good looks, so when he met the pretty boy Sol, who also pursued Joe, he lost his mind. He became possessive and territorial toward Joe, like a cat. I guess he was overall like a cat—not good at conveying emotions. He felt jealous towards everyone who was close to Joe (And the jealousy award of 2024 goes to... drum roll!). He wanted Joe all to himself but also infatuated with Tong at the sametime.

Ming came from a dysfunctional family and was very young, never having loved or dated anyone before. Joe's kind and mature love was foreign to him. It was also his first time being loved by anyone unconditionally. Which was why he hid his background from Joe. Because, he wouldn't want Joe to treat him like others did.

Ming and Sol's fight over Joe was hilarious. It was like two black cats fighting over a golden retriever. Ming especially trying to rip Oppa's hair was a sign that he was jealous of Sol's good looks. He was so blinded by jealousy he could not apprehend how humiliated Joe felt after realising that he was used as a rebound. Ming dumped all the blame over Sol as if Joe was bewitched by him. He just knew he can't let go of Joe. He tried every method to keep Joe- by baiting him with a better career and by locking him up.

The one thing I will never forgive is how he treated the new Joe and his distorted way of coping with grief. With the typical sexual jealousy and frustration of losing Joe, he acted like a madman and released all his frustration on new Joe. The same thing he did with Joe when he was alive and Ming was obsessing over Tong. That kind of behavior should already put the audiences off. The author should have sent him for therapy before their reconciliation.

But, I really wanted to see Ming cry in ep 9 when he caught Joe red handed. I enjoyed those chapters from novel where he cried and begged Joe to get back together, felt anxious that Joe might leave him again. But no. He was as insidious, cold blooded and scheming as ever. He didn't shed a single tear when he realized Joe is still alive. He was promising Joe to make him famous in exchange for staying with him. Like bro! He died because of you. Try harder to make amends.

I personally believe Joe's lack of boundaries made Ming think that no matter how he treated Joe, Joe would never leave. Joe should have prioritized his needs when he was cohabiting with Ming. Ming was arrogant, selfish, and self-centered. But he suffered greatly after Joe's death. That was his punishment for what he did to Joe. But I hoped to see a better redemption arc.

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